Hunter not guilty in trail death

[jonovision_man]

Man shoots deer, stray pellet kills hiker.

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/art ... death?bn=1

I have tremendous sympathy for both parties... neither was doing anything wrong, just an accident.

With the large populaton in the Toronto area, I don't see how you can safely have multi-use trails and hunting in the same areas... there are just too many people, this kind of thing is inevitable. Some of the solutions proposed make sense, ie. having certain days designated for hunting, others for trail use... or different areas entirely. But I expect something will have to change.

jono

[Darth Tater]

How terribly tragic.

[eme]

This hunter should have been convicted.

I handle firearms on a regular basis (part of the job) and you NEVER pull the trigger unless you are sure of your surroundings - that and shooting a deer (a buck no less) with a shot gun is cruel, as it will most likely prolong the suffering of the animal (wound verses kill the animal).

[jonovision_man]

So I'm not a hunter, but I just wonder how you could ever be entirely certain in a forest that there is nothing behind the thing you're shooting? Especially if you're using buckshot... that's an interesting point you make, surely it's more dangerous than a rifle shot.

jono

[clocker]

I have lived in a remote area since 1991 and we see a lot of pressure from hunters. I enjoy hunting more than killing. I'll hunt with a camera as willingly as a firearm, but I'm also a wild food lover.

Our local (Manitoba) CBC radio noon show has been carrying stories of rural folks and their encounters with hunters and it's not been a pretty tale.

I have been moved to rage on a number of occasions over hunting practices. Once when my horses were being stalked and on another occasion when people fired toward our house while being unable to resist the lure of some sharp tail grouse. They were firing high powered rifles. Like there would be anything left to eat! Our neighbour has bullet holes in the front of his house from this type of "sportsman."

I have no sympathy for the hunter. None. I don't know the particulars of this case, but I really don't care either. If these folks were not hunting each other, then the burden of responsibility has to rest firmly with the hunter. Like he didn't know how far a shot travels and can remain dangerous? Please.

Like driving, I think the standards for permission to carry a fire arm are far too lax. Seemingly here, it's not an activity that attracts the brightest bulbs in the pack. Our evenings are rife with "sportsmen" that creep along lonely country roads in their vehicles at dusk, hunting from the road illegally. In the spring I've seen them blowing ducks out of the ditches when it's so far out of season it's sad. The mentoring is virtually lost to a redneck element that has a flagrant disregard for the law. I'm fed up with the low standards of conduct and the culture surrounding these types of "sportsmen."

Our conservation officers are MIA. When we first came here I participated in their programs to prevent incidents and promote good hunting practices. I was very disappointing to find that keeping paper work to a minimum and avoiding conflict seemed to have a much higher priority than taking any action to support the law.

I haven't had a rifle and scope pointed at me while I was running this year, but it's been known to happen. Every time I run, I run out in the open on municipal roads and I feel that I'm taking my life in my hands every time I do this through the hunting season.

I can't imagine hunting in a multi use area.

Done, and very angry to hear this news.
Ian

[turd ferguson]

+1 eme and clocker.

I'm no longer a hunter but I used to be, and where I come from we had a saying that there's no such thing as a hunting accident. If you can't be 100% sure of what's going to happen with your shot, you don't take it. Full stop.

[La]

I can't really comment on the hunting aspect because I have no experience with it. But I do find it scary and shocking that hunting and hiking are even allowed in the same areas!!

[VeloCarrie]

+1 eme and clocker.

I'm no longer a hunter but I used to be, and where I come from we had a saying that there's no such thing as a hunting accident. If you can't be 100% sure of what's going to happen with your shot, you don't take it. Full stop.

+2

I also echo exactly what clocker and eme said. I have guns (at my parent's farm). I have never used them hunting, just target practice. You NEVER take a shot unless you are positive where it will go. My dad talks and dreams hunting and if he were reading this, he would totally agree what eme and clocker said. Not only did the courts lose the opportunity to hold this hunter responsible for careless hunting and taking the life of this hiker, but they also lost the opportunity to make an example to all the even more careless hunters out there.

[Sandra]

I can't really comment on the hunting aspect because I have no experience with it. But I do find it scary and shocking that hunting and hiking are even allowed in the same areas!!

+1
especially since i've run along that area many times and i take my daughter hiking along the simcoe trails too.

[Jo-Jo]

+1 eme and clocker.

I'm no longer a hunter but I used to be, and where I come from we had a saying that there's no such thing as a hunting accident. If you can't be 100% sure of what's going to happen with your shot, you don't take it. Full stop.

+2

I also echo exactly what clocker and eme said. I have guns (at my parent's farm). I have never used them hunting, just target practice. You NEVER take a shot unless you are positive where it will go. My dad talks and dreams hunting and if he were reading this, he would totally agree what eme and clocker said. Not only did the courts lose the opportunity to hold this hunter responsible for careless hunting and taking the life of this hiker, but they also lost the opportunity to make an example to all the even more careless hunters out there.

I just finished a meeting with a client who is a hunter. When I told him about this news story he had the same reaction as the people above.

[DonnaRigs]

This hunter should have been convicted.

I handle firearms on a regular basis (part of the job) and you NEVER pull the trigger unless you are sure of your surroundings - that and shooting a deer (a buck no less) with a shot gun is cruel, as it will most likely prolong the suffering of the animal (wound verses kill the animal).

Well said!

[dgrant]

This is why hunting should be prohibited on all public lands, all the time. It goes against the fundamental "code" of parks and public conservancy: that any one visitor's use of the space does not inhibit another user's enjoyment of that same space. You can't mine, you can't clear cut, you can't build... why can you hunt? Why can one or two users effectively monopolize huge swaths of space for hours at a time? A mountain biker can't force other users to be on guard (with potential life-or-death consequences) for a kilometre in all directions. A hiker or trail runner can't. An angler can't. Why does one particular type of user get that privilege?

Private property is a different story.

[turd ferguson]

This is why hunting should be prohibited on all public lands, all the time. It goes against the fundamental "code" of parks and public conservancy: that any one visitor's use of the space does not inhibit another user's enjoyment of that same space. You can't mine, you can't clear cut, you can't build... why can you hunt? Why can one or two users effectively monopolize huge swaths of space for hours at a time? A mountain biker can't force other users to be on guard (with potential life-or-death consequences) for a kilometre in all directions. A hiker or trail runner can't. An angler can't. Why does one particular type of user get that privilege?

Private property is a different story.

That works in the inhabited parts of the country, but once you get away from the inhabited parts into areas that are 99.99% crown lands, its a different story. In most of the country, public lands are not the same thing as parks and conservation lands.

[HCcD]

This is why hunting should be prohibited on all public lands, all the time. It goes against the fundamental "code" of parks and public conservancy: that any one visitor's use of the space does not inhibit another user's enjoyment of that same space. You can't mine, you can't clear cut, you can't build... why can you hunt? Why can one or two users effectively monopolize huge swaths of space for hours at a time? A mountain biker can't force other users to be on guard (with potential life-or-death consequences) for a kilometre in all directions. A hiker or trail runner can't. An angler can't. Why does one particular type of user get that privilege?

Private property is a different story.

Perhaps, 'cause they are the only group that carries shotguns !!!

[dgrant]

This is why hunting should be prohibited on all public lands, all the time. It goes against the fundamental "code" of parks and public conservancy: that any one visitor's use of the space does not inhibit another user's enjoyment of that same space. You can't mine, you can't clear cut, you can't build... why can you hunt? Why can one or two users effectively monopolize huge swaths of space for hours at a time? A mountain biker can't force other users to be on guard (with potential life-or-death consequences) for a kilometre in all directions. A hiker or trail runner can't. An angler can't. Why does one particular type of user get that privilege?

Private property is a different story.

That works in the inhabited parts of the country, but once you get away from the inhabited parts into areas that are 99.99% crown lands, its a different story. In most of the country, public lands are not the same thing as parks and conservation lands.

Same principle, whether it's High Park or Kluane. I can't just walk in, rope off a huge area, and announce "This is mine. Your safety and enjoyment here is in my hands for the next 4 hours." That's what hunters basically do.

[Doonst]

Same principle, whether it's High Park or Kluane. I can't just walk in, rope off a huge area, and announce "This is mine. Your safety and enjoyment here is in my hands for the next 4 hours." That's what hunters basically do.

Here's a picture of me in Kluane. I hope that helps clear things up.

[trixiee]

I think that if you are going running in any area during the fall hunting season, you should wear orange - at the very least! Why this woman seems so against wearing orange is beyond my comprehension.

[Jo-Jo]

I think that if you are going running in any area during the fall hunting season, you should wear orange - at the very least! Why this woman seems so against wearing orange is beyond my comprehension.

She's obviously not a Maniac

I have no problem wearing Orange...I still do believe that hunters need to know exactly what the target is before opening fire.

Having said that I stay away from hiking in areas where I know there will be hunters during hunting season.

This article made me worry about running the K&P trail on Sunday but my co-worker tells me that at this point it's "bow" season where the hunter has to be 25 feet (or was that metres) from the target so I should be safe.

[purdy65]

I have never understood the lure of hunting - being a more urban/suburban type of girl, but I have to agree with the above. The hunter needs to be responsible for any shot coming from his/her firearm.

Hmmm then again Dick Cheney wasn't charged with anything when he shot his hunting buddy!

Lisa

[Darth Tater]

I have never understood the lure of hunting - being a more urban/suburban type of girl, but I have to agree with the above. The hunter needs to be responsible for any shot coming from his/her firearm.

Hmmm then again Dick Cheney wasn't charged with anything when he shot his hunting buddy!

Lisa

Wasn't his hunting buddy a lawyer though? Fair game.

[purdy65]

I have never understood the lure of hunting - being a more urban/suburban type of girl, but I have to agree with the above. The hunter needs to be responsible for any shot coming from his/her firearm.

Hmmm then again Dick Cheney wasn't charged with anything when he shot his hunting buddy!

Lisa

Wasn't his hunting buddy a lawyer though? Fair game.

Hmmm True that I guess!

[Chainsaw Baby]

According to the media report, the hunter saw something moving, took it for a deer, and fired his shotgun. I lived in Tottenham for a year and ran in the reforestation area.
1. There is a subdivision of 168 house (I counted on google maps) within 400 meters of the area. There is hunting in the area? Who thought that would be a good idea?
2. Deer normally don't like humans. I'm an exception. I have run with deer 30 meters away. I think they thought it was fun. I see them 2 - 3 times per week, so maybe they are used to me. If you are a hunter, do you really expect to find deer 500 meters from 168 houses? I don't think the hunter was from the Tottenham area (this is worded not to offend the unbalanced in Toronto).
3. He fired his gun at something that was moving? Does this not suggest more training/education is required? I don't see this as an accident involving an innocent hunter.

This is similar to letting your baby play in a box of handgrenades. I think it is time for us to realize that hunting in southern Ontario requires skill, knowledge and an adherence to safe practices.

I now understand why my co-workers ask me to run with antlers during hunting season.

[turd ferguson]

Hmmm then again Dick Cheney wasn't charged with anything when he shot his hunting buddy!

This was hotly debated in the legal community at the time - arguably the Vice President can't be charged with a crime while in office, only impeached. If he'd killed the guy they probably would have charged him and it would have been quite the debate whether he'd be immune from prosecution or not.

[Jo-Jo]

According to the media report, the hunter saw something moving, took it for a deer, and fired his shotgun.
.

That is frightening.
And once again confirms why I won't hike on Crown Land with C-Moss during hunting season.

[drghfx]

A couple of weeks ago in NS a horse (family pet ) had to be put down/died from being shot from one or more people on an ATV who they suspect were hunting at dusk, or during the night. They figured the hunter(s) mistook the horse for a deer. Another one of their horses had also been shot in the neck but it was under the mane and they only noticed it a day or two later when they saw the horse having trouble reaching down with its neck.

I don't get the hunting thing either. I had a co-worker who shot a very small deer a number of years ago. He was saying how he hid upwind and saw the deer wandering toward an open spot and waited bla, bla bla until he could shoot it. I'm thinking "You're proud you out-thought an animal with an IQ of 1? Good for you!"